- cross-posted to:
- mastodon@lemmy.ml
- cross-posted to:
- mastodon@lemmy.ml
I have my problems with Meta, but I’m hoping this will help Mastodon grow
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Do we really want Facebook users just for the growth? Quality beats quantity.
The good thing about the fediverse is that instances can choose with whom they want to federate.
In my opinion, there should always be choice and people with terrible opinions should be allowed to express them – just like others should be allowed to laugh, ignore and block them. Whether we like it or not, the fediverse includes everything from left-wing to right-wing extremists. But we can choose an instance which excludes all those unwanted posts, just like we’ll be able to block surveillance corporate instances.
bigotry isn’t only difference of opinion
What is considered bigotry often is a difference of opinion though.
It’s Threads, not Facebook.
And I won’t speak for anyone else, but yes, I want as many people on the fedi as possible.
In an ideal world I never have to log into Facebook, Twitter, IG, Threads or any of that proprietary nonsense to figure out what’s going on.
Fediverse? Do you mean, the Threadiverse?
I’m being cheeky to illustrate a point - Threads will almost certainly harm the overall health of the Fediverse in the long run, with users relying increasingly more on Threads’ instance[s] to use Mastodon services and connect to people.
Isn’t threadiverse already a term to specifically describe the kbin/lemmy/etc. style of fediverse service?
It’s both, it depends on context.
Here I mean a Fediverse that is mostly controlled by Threads.
I think you mean WASN’T threadiverse already a term.
Yes, it used to be. Soon, it won’t be.
Eh, I can see politicians self hosting their own instances from their party or what have you. Same with governments. There is a potential as well that x.com may decide to federate out of survival if it gets too big.
Why would they self-host and do work when they could just use Threads? It’s not like FB gives a fuck about treasonous political parties.
The same reason Trump has his own social network.
Own instances give a lot more control. They can be as outrageous as they like, full on Trumpian, even. They can also control what gets said in that space much more effectively, seeing as how they are the mods and admins. And they don’t have to worry about Meta or Reddit (I doubt Musk even cares) getting media backlash and removing them from the platform entirely.
Sure, Threads can defed from any controversial instances but it will be trivial to create a mirror that effectively refederates the problem instance.
The same reason Trump has his own social network.
Didn’t that only start when he was threatened for being kicked off Twitter?
But the other points for censoring ideas make sense.
This is just a guess, but I think that the likelihood of Twitter federating is almost to zero, unless forced by legislations to do so. It simply doesn’t benefit from that, since every group and individual leaving Twitter might as well defederate it, and odds are that the upper echelon there knows it.
Instead I think that Twitter will try to associate the Fediverse with terrorists and what have you, to indirectly smear shit into its competitor Faecesbook/Threats.
This may be a cynical view, but even if that does happen, the core ActivityPub protocol will still be intact and at worst be relegated to a small community of tech nerds, which is to say, basically the status quo.
The core of the software will be intact, but the community will be broken - because once Threads pulls the plug (EEE), instead of a stable community you’ll have a shrinking one.
Or from another angle, they won’t be able to entirely pull the plug. If they try to but users still want to be on mastodon, they can find another way.
That said, I support the immediate defederation with any threads instances.
They can pull it - most users in Threads will be interacting with other Threads users and content. Mastodon will be simply “that ideologically weird corner”, and in practice they won’t miss it.
For scale: Threads currently has 100M users. The Fediverse as a whole has 1.5M.
13+ million total users: https://fediverse.observer/stats
I’m counting only monthly active users, for both sides. FediDB lists 1.2M for the Fediverse, your link lists 1.7M of them.
And I think that will go both ways. I mean, we all already have the option of joining threads right now to interact with those 100M users but I have a feeling most that are here aren’t.
Their joining the fediverse will be more disruptive than their leaving it I think. And that’s not even considering the higher costs to anyone running instances, since all that extra volume won’t be processed and stored for free (though admittedly I am not familiar with the implementation details of how federated content is handled).
Their joining the fediverse will be more disruptive than their leaving it I think
Eternal September-like? It’s possible.
the core ActivityPub protocol will still be intact
Will it though? My guess is they’re working on “fixing it” to what they want 24/7.
When a company uses Embrace Extend Extinguish, they are relying on network effects to drive people to their side. So let’s say Threads comes out, starts federating, has a big established userbase, and then they come out with some new, proprietary killer feature. It could be great moderation tools - something kbin and the fediverse need, no doubt about it - but whatever the feature is, it draws users away from the existing fediverse infrastructure and into Threads. Threads then makes massive changes to the ActivityPub spec, building the walled garden back up again. Only this time, they’ve actually siphoned off some of the users you originally had in the community. The result isn’t the status quo, Meta peeled away users who otherwise would have stayed.
By the way, while a “small community of tech nerds” is perfectly fine in its own right, I would argue the fediverse has already grown beyond that community. They’re a large contingent no doubt, but there’s also law enthusiasts, news outlets, game developers, users from Germany, Japan, France, Finland, and I follow them all. To see them leave for Threads would be a shame.
Seriously, how does that dude manage to look so inhuman? He looks like someone pretending to be human and trying really hard, but missing that one last bit.
That one’s a classic.
The trick is to always be faking empathy.
And I would assume he chose that picture too. It’s not as bad at full size, at least he has some color to his skin and doesn’t look like an alien methhead as much.
is requirement to be billionaire
So the hate for this is now gone and replaced with praise? What happened to all the posts about how this is an attack on TNT frediverse when Meta first announced this integration?
My stance is still a hard fuck no to Threads entering the fediverse.
Edit: My reasoning can be read in my old comment here. It’s all still applicable in regard to meta/Threads federating.
There’s no logical reason to give them the benefit of the doubt or have unrealistically positive expectations given their overwhelmingly consistent track record.
Oh there’s hate, there are a lot of unreasonably, pro-threads upvotes and comments making the rounds.
Wouldn’t be surprised if it turns out 99% of them were written by ChatGPT or whatever FBs equivalent is.
There does seem to be some real voices and understanding with some of the comments, so probably a mix of paid and chabot. If chatbot is that good, we are really in some serious trouble.
For 3 to 4 sentences LLMs are indistinguishable from humans.
You don’t start noticing the idiosyncrasies until it gets a bit more repetitive and loses coherence during longer texts.
That’s so not good, I hope there are people working on ways to tell.
Hopefully, researchers are working on ways to detect these subtle differences.
Is it really so bad that people (or rather instances) are allowed to choose who to federate with? Currently instances with spam and other unwanted commenters get constantly defederated with. Threads will just be another one of them, while some people are happy to get more content. Or am I missing something?
Edit: I read your point about EEE and the destruction of the community, but we currently also have multiple communities here on lemmy which are quite extremist and mostly blocked. I’m still not convinced people who currently use the fediverse will switch to Threads. But maybe I’m too optimistic (altough XMPP largely died with Google defederating, other systems like matrix show that there’s still demand for federated messaging).
To be clear, I want it to be users deciding on Lemmy too. Also, people already here moving to threads wouldn’t be the problem, we’re small in comparison to them. It would be a few things:
- They would bring in a huge party of users that would take it over and overwhelm the current users. It would be like a cruise ship of tourists taking over a small town and breaking everything for the current residents.
- They could post to Lemmy, but we can’t really post to Mastodon. They’re going to send ads our way disguised as content, guaranteed.
- If they can manipulate the users from Mastodon, it’s going to get out of hand fast. They have teams of devs and psych engineering to accomplish that.
- This is volunteer ran, do we have enough energy to fight Meta when they try to enforce something?
- Can they manipulate Activity Pub software because we’re a small team of devs? If they can, they will.
- One person mentioned them having instance owners sign NDAs. What’s up with that?
Fuck off. Defederate these guys.
Someone did a breakdown here, I still think it’s a great idea to defed from them immediately.
https://wedistribute.org/2023/08/threads-new-terms-affects-the-fediverse/
Reading the article, they collect the data necessary to federate with an instance. If you or I were to run our own instance we would have access to the same data.
If they were to do anything with that data that they don’t have permission to do, like selling it. They would be in breach of the GDPR and fined 4% of their global annual income, and as we’ve seen with Apple, it’s not profitable to have two wildly separate versions of your product.
But again, Meta is first and foremost an advertising and data harvesting company, and many people aren’t happy at the idea of being subjected to this treatment from the vantage point of their own servers.
already defederated
Lmao.
Judging by the comments on that post, they’re just trying to run away from all the porn bots.
Would it be possible for the mastodon software to detect if users are connecting via threads and replace all images in posts with a different image - one that says e.g. telling people that Zuckerberg doesn’t care about raising tennage suicide rates through Instagram or something similar.
I don’t want my software pushing propaganda on me. Thanks but no thanks.
Good news: This will result in more average-user understanding of the fediverse, getting past the consistent issue of people not understanding it. It will increase the Fediverse’s usershare by a considerable amount. And to top it all off, it will probably cause a snowball which will make the Fediverse as a whole eclipse twitter.
Bad news: This is being done by facebook, willingly. Any company that is taking action like this is doing so for their own benefit and no one elses. This may be detrimental to the Fediverse in the long run if users opt to all just jump on to Threads because of some obnoxious ‘Embrace, Extend, Extinguish’ tactic they may or may not pull in the future.
So is there a way to follow someone on Threads now? Or at least get one’s instance to load a post? Where are the details of this beyond Zuckerberg’s post?
That’s great news
noooooooooooooooooooooooon
