- cross-posted to:
- technology@beehaw.org
- cross-posted to:
- technology@beehaw.org
In a nutshell if anything breaks you are screwed ;D
It’s an Apple device, what did you expect?
The thing even has an external battery pack, and instead of using USB-C so you could use any power bank you already own, they designed a completely new proprietary connector. In 2024.
Who the fuck does that anymore, except Apple?I can see the argument for having a connector that can’t be pulled out: if you were crossing a busy street or walking down a stairway with one of these strapped to your head and the cable came out, you’d be instantly blind.
Who the fuck wears a VR headset walking in the street, let alone crossing a road?
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No one, yet. The idea is (very obviously, I might mention) that we will be wearing AR or VR glasses just like many wear a smartwatch or carry a phone.
But the proprietary connector plug itself is almost identical to the lightning connector, the only difference is that the bolster has some notches in it for the BATTERY to lock into. All the locking is in the battery, they could have, should have, used USB C or any other existing connector.
the only difference is that the bolster has some notches in it for the BATTERY to lock into
Um, it has twice as many pins. The same number of pins as thunderbolt which likely isn’t a coincidence.
Exactly, so it could’ve just been USB C
Did USB-c match their needs?
I can’t imagine it wouldn’t. The USB-PD spec can cover a verity of voltage and amperage combinations covering practically any digital electronic device up to 100W.
The only reason it’s not used everywhere, is that it does add complexity to extremely simple and inexpensive devices. This thing is not simple or inexpensive, and it doesn’t draw more than 100W.
Up to 240W now actually
The USB-PD spec can cover a verity of voltage and amperage combinations
That’s not really true - it maxes out at 5 Amps which is only a decent amount of power if you use (relatively) high voltages. Vision Pro runs at 13 volts, which isn’t supported by USB and if it was that would only be 65 watts - nowhere near enough to power this product.
Running at higher voltages (USB can do up to 48 volts) would likely have problems, it might be less efficient for example (which would mean they have to give it a larger battery).
Yes, and apple did choose not to, so their customers will praise apple that they got ANOTHER only apple connector!
Not to mention the praise for “innovation”. I swear to God most of the “innovation” I see is more proprietary or useless shit to screw over the customer. I suppose regarding company priorities that’s excellent innovation.
You can use any USB battery with it, just plug it into the battery pack. Why? Because releasing this without a battery and leaving it to the customer to source one would be super weird.
No you can not? It has a lightning connector and a new apple connector, just wow what apple designs is just e-waste.
Battery pack accepts incoming USB-C charging. You can apparently daisy chain chargers together with any USB-C battery pack that can output the right power.
I’m just imagining some goober with a MacBook and Daisy chained battery packs and that weird mouse charger and the stylus sticking out out of their ipad
Yeah but then its another like 300g and then why in the first place have a battery pack? and thats even worse, a lightning output a usb-c input? Next they add a Serial Data input there.
External battery makes sense as the thing without it is already as heavy as a quest 2. Just absolutely no reason not to have it be a standard USB-PD power bank.
It has already, a external battery, it goes to the headset with a lightning ( battery side ) a apple connector ( headset ), so another batter on the already heave battery pack is like having a backpack full of daisy chained battery packs ( dont do it! Fire hazard! ).
I don’t think it has power pass through, meaning that the electricity goes into apples battery pack, into the battery, then into a device. A power pass through means, upon battery and device charging, the battery will route the power from the wall (or second battery) directly to the device.
Power pass through is important because without it there’s great inefficiency (less run time) and lots of heat. The battery is being both charged and discharged, creating more heat and wearing the battery down significantly. And also for the love of God just let me plug in any battery I want to.
I bet it does have power pass through. Lots of people are going to use this all day at a desk and you’d get to a thousand cycles in just three months if plugging it into the wall just charges the battery. It needs to be passthrough.
Yes you can. The battery plugs into the wall with USB-C.
Like said before, what a joke then, headset => battery pack ( apple connector and a lightning connector ) => wall socket ( Usb to ?? ). Apple, next time please add another step where the wall socket connector has a serial connector, just to increase e-waste even more.
I own two, they are pretty great. It is not ideal having a battery pack with a cable but it is not that big of a problem. 98% of my usage so far has been sitting, if I am standing and using it then I am usually not standing using it for 2-3hrs at a time anyway. Most of the areas in my house have a USB-C plug nearby anyway so I just plug in the battery back when I sit down and continue using it, it really isn’t much of an issue.
This issue is similar to how some people love wireless keyboard and some people hate them but for most people it doesn’t matter to much. This is a doesn’t matter too much issue for everyone who has tried this thing, and honestly, if you have the money to buy a Vision Pro then do it or don’t but I don’t think many people are seriously going to be dissuaded from the purchase due to the battery issue. I was concerned about it before purchase but it isn’t really an issue for me after using it a lot over the past few days. Most of my hundreds of hours of VR usage over the past decade have been sitting near a charger anyway, so I won’t really be an issue going forward for me anyway. I’d prefer it to have an onboard battery that would last for a week’s worth of usage but we’re not there yet and I am under no illusions that we should be there now. As far as existing tech goes this device is a window into the future and it is setting the roadmap for how this tech will be used in the future. It only gets better from here.
Woah did you take out a loan or what? If apple is there it doesnt get better, it gets just in the direction “Boring Future Dystopia”
You’re a little slow. I’ll spell this out for you. Headset to battery with built in connector. Included battery to any battery bank of your choice with any usb-c cable.
Imagine if you could just connect it to any battery bank, like I do with my Quest 2 via USB-C. Only 300 bucks.
Like said, its totally useless either way, either to an another powerbank or to the wall socket. Still it would be utterly useless and could be a fire hazard to daisy chain powerbanks. And next time you can be a little bit more respectful. I did not offended you or said something bad to you.
You’re wrong, go watch some review videos.
I meant directly to the headset, of course you can dangerously daisy chain another battery pack with usb-c to the battery pack ( thats a possible fire hazard btw, so please dont try it out thx )
Why is it dangerous? If the battery can deliver 30W then it’s in spec.
Its dangerous like all the other reasons why not to daisy chain a extension cords.
Actually, if it breaks you get Apple to fix it. I think anyone who is spending $$3500+ on a portable device knows to be careful with it and doesn’t want it to break.
Anyone who is spending 3500 on a portable toy has more money than sense and isn’t going to worry about it…
Portable toy for you but it is not a portable toy for me, I bought 2 of them for valid reasons and also have more sense than money so I bought the AppleCare insurance on both of them as well, so if there is an issue I can get it fixed.
You can make all sorts of fallacy arguments you want about how this device is not practical for your life and try and paint the buyers of these as selfish, greedy, dumb or whatever else you want but that doesn’t make it true. There are people out, probably a lot of them, that do have a good reason for buying these. For me, as someone who suffers from pretty extreme sensory issues due to my autism and also suffering from ADHD, it is a very useful device to help me get a better handle on my disability. Pair that with my background as a documentary filmmaker and how often I travel, it is an incredibly useful tool for me and its value is worth more than the close to $5000 I paid for each of mine (tax, lens inserts, AppleCare and 1tb storage version). This device gives me much more freedom and ability to work, with limited distractions in many environments I struggled to work in before. Also, I wanted to experiment with the immersive video.
Judge others all you want if that is how you want to spend your time, if it helps you to care that much about how other people spend more money than you are willing to spend on a product that is incredibly useful to them but not to you, so be it. Just seems like a waste of time to me to be that worked up about something you don’t like that much. But you do need to know that there are people these products are made for, they just aren’t made for you… yet, I don’t know if you would even be interested in something like this. I don’t get worked up at all knowing that a double amputee has to spend tens of thousands of dollars to get high tech prosthetic arm that improve their lives immensely or that a filmmaker spends hundreds of thousands of dollars on equipment to do their job or to explore new tech that may help them do their job better.
Just think about it for a moment. Apple made a mask, that when you wear it in your face, projects a 3D animated avatar if you face on the outside. That is so weird, f’ed up and dystopian.
I won’t argue about whether this is dystopian, but the practical reason for the face projection is that they wanted to make this not just something you wear sitting alone in your basement, like most other VR headsets. They wanted it to be usable around other people, at a workplace, with family, etc.
Interacting with someone wearing a full face blind is just weird, so they thought that making the eyes visible would help make this a bit more socially usable.
I’m not sure that’s really going to work out — seems at least as awkward as Google’s failed Glass project — but Apple’s design decision has some merit.
Given the number of TV shows and movies around this topic, I can sense this change coming.
If I have to interact with someone that’s wearing goggles, I might go full Luddite.
Google Glass really feels smarter in this particular regard.
Also they decided to stuff everything into the headset.
Maybe making it a separate thing and moving as much mass and volume as possible to something worn on your belt or your back would be a better idea. EDIT: But I do understand how this doesn’t fit their marketing.
It’s a VR headset. It’s not a social experience.
But that’s what Apple is trying to change. They don’t call it a VR headset. They don’t even use the phrase “virtual reality” because they don’t want people thinking of it as a VR headset.
Their goal is to get people used to wearing a headset to do normal “real” world things. They want it to be AR, not VR. It’s like getting people used to a touchscreen, or not having a headphone jack, or a big-ass notch in the screen.
Their long-term goal is likely glasses that can do the same things as this headset, but with transparent screens, so that they don’t need the outer display. And then it won’t be VR-first, it’ll be AR-first.
Way to ignore the entire comment and show that you don’t understand VR in the slightest, all in one sentence.
Ever heard of Taklings House Party? I’ve also spent many a night throwing back a few beers and taking turns in Beat Saber.
I wouldn’t go so far as fucked up and dystopian. It’s just an odd style choice.
I don’t think I can agree with this.
The face projection was likely an afterthought. They were already deep into the 3D face scan into avatar world with things like continuity camera and lidar. Granted, I don’t believe they are currently able to reposition the face into a completely different angle (top down into forward facing) with continuity camera, but that’s where their tech was going anyway. And they wanted to be able to have user facial expressions in device regardless.
All they did in this case was slap a screen on the front and display the avatar the thing is already generating, then call it a feature and upcharge with a 1000% markup on the total cost.
It’s a gimmick, that’s all it ever was. Meant to make this look like a sleeker device than it is with some clever marketing.
Not dystopian, just disappointing.
I don’t know, I could see the value if it really looked like the mask was semi transparent.
So it’s a cool idea, the only problem is that they didn’t deliver and the result is creepy instead.
Not only did they make something that weird, they put an absolute shit load of effort into doing so. That teardown video was insane.
That is so weird, f’ed up and dystopian.
It’s not as weird as the Meta Quest, where you literally have no idea wether the person wearing it is looking at you or not.
The view of someone’s eyes is very low quality - I’ll give you that. But it’s better than nothing at all. And I’m not sure they could’ve done better without doubling the price of the product.
Imagine engineering something that complicated only for it to be a disappointing product. I have no doubt it’s a step toward better products but at the same time they could’ve done better. Maybe spend more time polishing the actual parts that matter instead of creating the world’s most complicated weird fake blurry eyes?
I don’t think the blurry eye thing is a major important feature. it’s just the weirdest
That is literally my point. It took a lot to engineer that, which is seen in the teardown video.
sorry. you mentioned the eyes and then said disappointing product in the same sentence. I don’t know if it’s disappointing or not but the stupid eye feature wouldn’t be the thing that disappointed or impressed me.
I’m waiting for a really nice passthrough productivity headset to happen, and I’m glad this is the direction apple wants to go. I’m sure some company that isn’t apple will do it better than this soon.
I don’t think it is a disappointing product, I think it is pretty amazing actually.
Blurry eyes, yeah, that outward facing screen is an interesting choice but it makes sense with that they were going for. Based on all the tech in the Vision Pro I doubt that outward facing screen added much in terms of cost to the Bill of Materials but it is a nifty thing to try out. I’d rather have companies experimenting with this type of thing than only making predictable products over and over again with only minor improvements.
I don’t think it is productive to bad mouth a product that you probably haven’t even tried yet and probably would not be buying anyway.
Apparently you haven’t read the reviews
I own two of them, I have been using it extensively since I picked them up on Friday morning from a nearby Apple Store.
But if that isn’t good enough for you, I also extensively read reviews before purchasing them and have continued to read other people’s thoughts on it.
If you spent well over 7 grand on 2 headsets you can only wear one of… You are the level of fanboy beyond cartoonish and there is definitely nothing that could break the illusion needed to justify that sort of insane spending.
Its literally the Apple targeted customer.
And?
Close to 10 grand actually.
It may be hard for you to accept that this may be a useful product for a limited number of people but it is true, I am one of them.
I explain more about it in another post here;
https://lemmy.world/comment/7267113
If you want to keep shaming people for using the money they earned through hard work to justify your… I don’t know what it is you are trying to prove, it doesn’t really matter. I just find it kind of silly that you can’t accept that this product isn’t made for you.
I for one applaud companies that are willing to try something different and to push the technological envelope to see what’s possible. I think your comments and negativity will be seen, in time, in a similar light to the naysayers of the iMac, iPod, iPhone, iPad, AirPods and so many non-Apple products that ended up being incredibly successful.
This is not a fully formed standalone product just yet, it is the beginnings of a new market segment, it doesn’t have to be your exact image of perfection for this product type, you need to crawl before you can walk and you need to walk before you can run. Give it time and there will be more universally appealing versions of this, let the bleeding edge adopters beta test this for you and in a few years I think you will owe them a thank you. I’ll be enjoying my time until then using my Vision Pros and giving feedback to Apple about how it can be improved upon to maybe someday win you over.
If you want to keep shaming people for using the money they earned through hard work
Yes, the once in a lifetime that someone admitted to setting ten grand on fire, I definitely have no shame in shaming them for it. That is more money than I think is fair for most used cars…
In 1994 I played rise of the triad in a “VR” headset. Since that time, we have barely progressed past that. This iteration is an absurdly complicated, severely overpriced hunk of heavy-ass junk just slightly better than some before it.
To tell you the truth, 20 years from now when there’s an actually good version of this product, almost certainly not built by apple, I’ll only be interested if it’s not absurdly expensive. Maybe not even then, we’ll see.
You are acting like you’re some kind of martyr for being a guinea pig and blowing a fuckton of money in doing so. That’s weird and sad.
Ahh I see, you read my link to understand where I am coming from and why I bought them and also I see that you have the mentality of a teenager who is unable to understand that others may have different needs and different levels of consumer spending. Got it.
Well enjoy your life of shaming a mentally handicapped (autism & ADHD with severe sensory issues where this device very much helps diminish) professional documentary filmmaker who finds this device well worth the price. Committing $5,000 more for the second unit was also well worth the price to be able to run dailies with my editor who may be on the other side of the planet from where I am but we can share a virtual editing bay together in real time is much more valuable than the price I paid for that second unit. In terms of business, and especially my business, $5,000 is not a whole lot of money. It will pay for itself in terms of time saved within a month or less based on my average hourly pay. It is a good investment and I am sorry you can’t accept that.
I see you are committed to digging this hole for yourself and feel bad for the people in your life who are very tired of how subjective and stubborn you are, it must be very tiring for them to put up with you, I can very much relate to that in my brief encounter with you. Good luck buddy.
Oh, and, you seem like a very prescient business person with their finger on the pulse of the tech industry when you say that “we have barely moved past” the VR experience back you had back in 1994. Enjoy your myopic pancake view of the world my friend, I hope you change your mind because you are missing out on a pretty great world filled with interesting things that you have never experienced but have strong negative feelings toward.