You might’ve noticed Framework, the laptop manufacturer, embroiled in a controversy as of now. The Discord server is on lockdown because the volunteer moderation team has gone on hiatus, and the Framework forum post about the controversy has been gaining unsightly amounts of steam from people disappointed at actions taken by Framework.
Fair Warning: Long rant ahead.
Great article, and it gets to the heart of something I’ve felt is becoming more and more prominent in the Linux and Open Source Community, and really any community. And it’s something we simply can’t ignore.
That is that you can’t separate politics from life. It’s everywhere. The author points out that Framework’s mission is to encourage right to repair and responsible consumption by discouraging planned obsolescence.
While right to repair might be popular in both left and right wing circles, that is only because both sides want control over their devices and to distance themselves from Big Tech. But their views on regulation with regards to the environment and social equity/inclusion are as far apart as the general right left paradigm is as a whole.
To be blunt, you simply cannot have normal people work under the same tent as crypto fascists, transphobes, and general right wing grifters, no matter how significant their individual contributions might be.
I personally am tired of these sorts of controversies being brushed under the rug by tech influencers like BashBunni and Brodie Robertson who in their coverage of Omarchy did not broach this topic even just to say that there is a controversy at all. It’s cowardice at best, and right wing apologism at worst.
Yes, there are particularly brilliant software engineers that are also assholes. And yeah, without those assholes, we wouldn’t have the technologies we have today. The mistake is thinking that they are brilliant because they are assholes. Another mistake is thinking that holding onto one productive asshole is better than hanging onto the good will and contributions of many normal people that still provide worthwhile contributions.
To be very frank, fuck that. I refuse to believe in the false dichotomy that in order to create good software we have to put up with bigots. If anything, their attitudes end up holding themselves and their colleagues back. We shouldn’t be asking ourselves, “How much less productive would that person have been if they had wasted time/energy on being socially conscious and empathetic.” And instead have asked “How much more productive and better off we all would have been had they been a more empathetic and compassionate person.” Because we’re all worse off when a colleague is being a bigot, and it’s in all of our interests to call it out when we see it.
Preach. thank you for this ❤️
I don’t disagree with anything you’re saying.
I just want people to ponder this: What happens when we ostracize people with bigoted beliefs from our communities? Does that mean we have given up on the idea that communities can change people? Does that mean our community is not responsible for helping people realize their bigotry?
I think the ostracization can be more of a catalyst for individual change than just ignoring them and letting them infect a community.
That is true. To be clear: I don’t advocate for allowing or ignoring hate speech.
Yeah, I’ve heard this response to my argument more times than I care to mention.
Let’s be clear, I don’t want to give off the impression I’m not open to people changing for the better. If you can end bigotry through discussion instead of arguments or worse yet, violence, then obviously that is preferable.
The issue is that for every honest misinformed person I’ve encountered who is open to listening to differing points of view, I’ve easily encountered 10 right wing grifters who are in bad faith trying to distract from the main problem with whataboutisms and other tactics, with the end goal of dehumanizing and ostracizing groups that they perceive as the other, i.e. minorities.
These people are in their adult years, likely grew up in households where they themselves were bullied, harassed, made fun of, and dehumanized. They then went to school where sadly they were likely to have experiences that further eroded their emotional intelligence and ability to connect with anybody who had differing views from them. They then grew up and sought out others who had suffered similar experiences and come to similar misguided conclusions, either online or IRL. These are people who grew up being told that apologizing was a sign of weakness, to never ever admit that they were or ever will be wrong, and to only play at having empathy in order to have a seat at the discussion table where they could then present their ideas as “just asking questions.” When in fact they are trying to sow discord and form a pipeline into their hateful ideology for others who are emotionally vulnerable and open to ideas as to why life didn’t play out for them like they thought it would.
If they lack critical thinking skills and a strong community support structure, these emotionally vulnerable people end up spewing hateful ideology within a few months and it breaks my heart, because usually there’s no coming back for them. They can’t be argued or reasoned with. It’s as if an empathetic child who just needed community died due to abandonment, and some ghoul due to demonic corruption is left in their place.
Its not that I don’t want to believe that people can change for the better. I’ve seen it in myself and others, I know it is real.
But I’ve also been in enough online, and in some cases, offline, spaces to know a bigot when I see one. I can sniff a disingenuous asshole just trying to “ask questions” from a mile away and it always ends up with a bunch of 4chan transphobes either openly or behind closed doors making fun of a minority and in some of the worst cases, planning violence.
My tolerance for even the smallest inkling of hate speech is zero. I’m just done giving these people enough rope to hang people I care about with.
I appreciate your response. I do not want to be in the same room as people that think my peers or I shouldn’t exist based on identity. Therefore people experiencing desires of fascism aren’t welcome. I still personally ponder how to rehabilitate them.
i think there has to be a balance. if these people are not rehabilitated or dealt with quickly enough, it will cause those who are targeted by or against such bigotry to feel like the don’t belong. they will likely interact with the community less and potentially leave it.
i’m not saying we shouldn’t try to rehabilitate those we think can be saved, but there are unfortunately tradeoffs.
I understand and agree.
Well, I do think the first step would be calling out their bad behavior. Maybe they don’t think what they’re saying is so bad, or maybe they think their peers are okay with it. On that point, I don’t think financially supporting them will indicate we don’t approve of their statements or behavior.
They often have other communities that validate the bad ideas. So they feel “censored” when they act the same way in public and get reprimanded. When it is actually just communities moderating hate.
Ostracism is how communities change people with bigoted beliefs. When communities ostracise open bigotry, most bigoted people will at least keep their bigotry to themselves, in order not to be ostracised.
Okay. I’ve been pondering myself for a while. I think I asked the wrong questions previously.
The situation isn’t about ostracizing users, it is about a desire for a company to not platform and financially support fascist people. Which makes total sense to me.
the worst part of framework’s response is their “oh we partner with anybody we don’t see politics”; which is literally just the “if there’s a nazi at the table and 10 other people sitting there talking to him, you got a table with 11 nazis”
DHH is a massive piece of shit. I keep seeing his stupid name popping back up recently and I wish he would go the fuck away. No community needs his toxic views.
good thing is most of the rails community think the same thing and actively distance themselves from him
Yeah, I’ve been keeping track of that one and they are trying to get him removed from any sort of leadership role over the community.
He’s been a dirt bag for as far back as I can remember.
it’s because of his Arch .dotfiles believe it or not. People are hailing it as the “second coming” of linux.
It’s not even good. It’s just scripts for some starter Arch rice, not a serious distro.
I understand why Framework would support Hyprland as it is warts and all because, I believe, it’s one of the most famous/successful projects in its domain. But Omarchy? That shit is new and unproven, there are much better distros to support.
I think there’s some sort of a west coast trend towards immutable distros. Bazzite has the same kind of buzz. Haven’t really met anyone that uses these distros around me, though.
Goddammit, Framework!
specifically, Twitter,
This is correct.
Insted of banning abrasive people from forums, we could flag them and use AI as a filter on everything they say in that forum. In a similar vein of how Overwatch dealt with trolls in their ingame chat. If you say “too easy” your message is replaced with something less abrasive. Take away their power to be assholes for no reason. Make it a little badge “I’m an asshole”.
Given the amount of publicity they’ve received from all this, I’m inclined to be a bit conspiracy theoretic about this… Did they plan it to unfold exactly like it did? Are you all helping them?
Controversy and infamy lasts for a few months, but after that’s over, the name Framework is still etched into everyone’s minds even though they don’t anymore exactly remember why.
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Insted of banning abrasive people from forums, we could flag them and use AI as a filter on everything they say in that forum. In a similar vein of how Overwatch dealt with trolls in their ingame chat. If you say “too easy” your message is replaced with something less abrasive. Take away their power to be assholes for no reason. Make it a little badge “I’m an asshole”.
