Edit: It works! Not beautiful and shows a concerning amount of “Error” lines on startup but it will do. I got VSCodium and ESP-IDF running, at least – and CMake isn’t awfully slow despite it being a crappy 4GB RAM machine (not easily upgradeable). The first boot took a while and I haven’t rebooted since, I guess it will be below 30 seconds next time (Mint on same machine but HDD was about 1 minute).
Edit: I hope I chose the right kernel here, surprisingly not much info online on this! Also, I picked “targeted” because the 10-year-old system does not use any cutting-edge hardware and all drivers should be auto-detected, I think.
After some experience with Linux Mint, I gathered the courage to try another distro. I’d like to turn an old laptop into an IPTV receiver plus FTP/OpenVPN/HomeAssistant server with occasional desktop use. I first installed Windows 11 just in case my family needs to use it (it fucking sucks, the built-in PS/2 keyboard doesn’t work half the time but that’s an issue for later) but now I’ll be turning it into a dual-boot setup with Debian as the primary option. Please give me some encouragement, I’m really afraid of new things.
Old pic: https://lemmy.ml/pictrs/image/d4bf0222-4fc1-42ab-a3e9-464087dec3af.png
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It’s Debian. Let us know when you have your first real issues with it, probably some time in 2037.
Don’t be too hopeful, it will probably be the upgrade to Debian 14 in 2030. And the issue will probably be: yes, you need to change the repo and then full-upgrade.
I had some getting it to run on a Chuwi HI8 but the thing is a terrible tablet-PC pretending to be a terrible Android tablet…
See my newest comment with the monospaced text.
But yeah, not a real issue, I fixed it in 15 minutes. Apparently it was foolish of me to want Num Lock on the lock screen (Czech keyboard layout uses the number row for diacritics).
Edit: Now I fixed that too. I can easily use numbers in my password now!
You don’t need luck. You chose wisely.
Just a little warning if you boot both OS from the same drive. Windows update can and will break your bootloader at one point (if not worse, tho that’s rare). Keep a Linux live or rescue stick around in case something breaks.
Yeah, I know this, what a pain… I eventually had to install rEFInd on one of the PCs with dual boot.
I love Debian. Been using it on my laptop for over a year. Some specific drivers are a little fiddly if you have nvidia graphics but it’s not too bad, lots of good info on the debian wiki.
Damn near every distro is fiddly with Nvidia graphics, they’re practically a criminal cartel, they give Nouveau 0 support (ok fine, lately a bit, but probably not enough)
This shouldn’t be a thing of luck, if you are prepared.
No, I’m absolutely not. What desktop environment should I choose? KDE Plasma is tempting - it would be nice to use it before I install it with Arch on my main system - but I don’t need the cutting edge or much personalization. I know XFCE best but GNOME is default… GNOME’s big launcher looks great for the TV but it’s also more resource-hungry and less customizable…
I guess I’ll go with the familiar Windows-style XFCE and maybe add big remote-friendly icons later when I configure an IR receiver.
What desktop environment should I choose
That’s the beauty … You can change any time you want (sudo tasksel) withjout losing your data. or install all of them and choose one each time you login
I have been using Gnome for a few weeks (because I have an issue with my tablet and Plasma works badly with it), and it’s shit. Very locked in, strange choices regarding how information is presented, waste of screen estate (topbar that sits completely unused)… Plasma was a million times better. If I didn’t have this tablet problem… anyway that’s my advice. Have fun. Debian is stable, you should be good
I love this, because I feel the complete opposite in some regards. I love the simplicity of GNOME. There are some weird UI decisions; I much prefer to have the dock available on the desktop than to use the application switcher every time, but that’s about it. GNOME is very thematically consistent, it’s simple, and it works smoothly. It has enough customisation where the sensible defaults fall short, at least for me, but theme-wise I really like Adwaita the way it is.
I use KDE on my laptop though, and I enjoy the tinkering with it. Feel like it’s fairly unstable though, Plasma just crashes at times when you tinker with it (though so far it’s never happened in normal usage). Design-wise it feels much too cluttered, but there’s a lot of options to play with to make things at least almost the way I’d like it.
We’re spoiled for choice, and that’s awesome. There’s something for everyone.
Yea to be frank I also love the simplicity of Gnome. I do apreciate its qualities. It’s consistent, I get that it tries to offer a streamlined experience. I find it sacrifices a lot to get there though. The lack of flexibilty (by default without extensions) wrt window/workspace management feels a bit crippling. I do appreciate the consistency. But that’s not enough for me to make up for other aspects. And for the overhanging feeling that it’s so strongly opinionated, it might just diverge from your sensibilities at some point, without warning.
Yea, the single fact that we’re able to talk about this is a testament to the choice… 👌🏼 Pretty cool. All in all I may like Plasma better, there are true dealbreakers that make its usage impossible for me (tbc). Anyway. For now I work under Windows11. Whatever works
I tried KDE plasma and I was blown away by how bad the UI design is. I struggled for like an hour trying to customize my desktop and it crashed a few times and even when it wasn’t crashing I was flummoxed by how unintuitive the customization UI is. I couldn’t get anything the way I wanted it and yes I agree: incredibly visually busy. I wanted to have a gnome alternative but it felt like beta software to me, and badly designed on top of it. Hard pass!
People who hate gnome so much always confuse me.
I have used gnome, plasma, and xfce and they are all fine. I prefer KDE personally but they’re all going to do what you need to do. It’s all down to personal aesthetic preference, and picking one won’t hinder you in any real way. KDE to me just looks super nice out of the box for my taste, and I like the customization.
Well, you can try a Live CD for first contact. Or even a virtual machine, with a complete install of the operating system and desktop environment, without touching your actual system.
KDE Plasma is very nice if you come from Windows and don’t mind an environment that’s somewhat heavy on performance - personally, I think it’s the closest, modern Windows-like experience. XFCE is very lightweight, but not very modern, as far as I remember.
Don’t forget, you can also install multiple environments and then pick one from your login screen; that way you can try them all and see what fits best
If it’s 10 year old hardware, you should be fine.
I’ve only had problems in Debian with brand new hardware where I have to use the backport branch to get drivers (like for wifi.)
Though mainly I use Ubuntu, where I would not have that problem. Not sure why you switched from mint.
Weirdly, Debian currently has a newer version of Xfce than Linux Mint. Not everything on there is out of date.
I recently helped a friend install Debian via sms, it was surprisingly easy, and she had never tried installing Linux before. When installing on a laptop I’d recommend using cable instead of wifi, and then setup wifi when the system is up and running.
Best of luck
Gee! How long did it take to transfer the iso via sms? Did you have to uuencode it?
🤣 🤣 🤣
Nah, he Base4017’d it. That’s Base64 plus all the emojis. It’s actually quite efficient.
I just made the switch from Win 10 to Bazzite Linux some two weeks ago. It worked so great that I should have done it a long time ago.
Good luck! And don’t forget to add the non-free-firmware repo and maybe the other additional ones if you need them. A standard Debian comes without. And if you’re following an old tutorial, that might not cover the split between non-free and non-free-firmware which happened somewhat recently in Debian terms. Their own documentation is good and up to date, though.
Obligatory you should use Arch btw.
(Good luck)
I’ll be installing Arch on my main laptop when I make the disk space and get the motivation (my mental state is almost as messy as the drive). I’ll also take the opportunity to reinstall Windows because it’s an old copy where I chose my real name as the user directory name (I didn’t know better back then), with a space and diacritics, which broke lots of things. But this is a server and I preferred Mint to Manjaro so Debian it is.
I would suggest when you decide to give Arch a go for the first time to start out with something like CachyOS to get your legs under you so you can easily understand it. That being said Arch is painfully easy to install now thanks to Archinstall but going the CachyOS route it’ll install the packages you need and then you can understand what you do and don’t need when it comes time to install regular Arch. Otherwise you might just install Arch and then wonder why some stuff doesn’t work because you didn’t install certain packages.
Why is archinstall “painfully” easy? Do you think its users will do badly at troubleshooting because they didn’t go through a setup process that teaches more about the system?
it’s because with Archinstall it tells you what to do/setup as opposed to the user having to utilize something like the Arch Wiki to set it up. So it acts almost like any other distro install. It walks you through the process.
I know what archinstall does but why did you say “painfully”?
I spent several hours trying to figure out how to install Arch manually, before discovering Archinstall.
I now have it running on two old laptops.
My main PCs are running Kubuntu though.
Mint is solid, if you use it and it works for you why change? Do you need to bother with windows? What do you use that can’t be done on Linux I wonder? Perhaps work out how to set a VM and try out Debian and even windows in a test sandbox so you’re comfortable with the processes before taking the plunge. Check out KVM, QEMU, and Virt-Manager.
I have worked with VMs before and still use an XP one sometimes. But modern Windows in a VM on an old laptop with 4 GB of RAM? I’ll pass…
I like it so far.
VSCodium
Try Kate.
(The real answer is probably emacs/vim but I’m not that cool.)
