The fact that Ram drivers are a close second is hilarious. I guess there is some truth to all the jokes about Rams being driven by aggressive idiots.
Aggressive drunk* idiots. Statistically.
At least Tesla owners can blame it on the computer. 🤣
“It appears the fault was located between the drivers seat and steering wheel, sir”
Good ole close the ticket with message “PEBKAC”
What was it? 25% more likely to have a DUI record?
I am still waiting for the inevitable country music song about a broken hearted cowboy whose self driving car leaves him for another man.
I think there might be something to be said here for some potential selection bias. Are Tesla drivers like ram drivers, overly aggressive idiots but with the added layer of being relatively new tech?
More boringly , maybe its selection on the circumstances too. For example maybe ev’s tend to drive more in urban environments, more urban may mean more collision opprtunities per time spent driving.
Of course ram is a farmers vehicle is desgned for rural use, so must rarely be seen in built up areas. /s
edit: having glanced at the cited article - theres no obvious mention of any risk adjustment, the measures seem to be simple ratio of crashes per driver. No obvious control for whether the sub-population spend more or less time driving.
Rate per - place-specific-risk adjusted person-hour would work better.As often with things like risk, it really helps to be able to do a multidimensional analysis. See if vehicle type/brand is significant after controlling for as many circumstantial factors and exposure related factors as you can reliably observe.
I assure you that large obnoxious trucks are a status symbol for many idiot right wing boomers and gen x, who take pride in daily driving a truck for their commute into, inside, and outside of cities.
They also complain about traffic, while simultaneously doing everything they can to under or unfund public transit, because they are literally incapable of understanding that adding more lanes to highways does not actually reduce traffic.
EDIT oh NO i missed the /s.
Oh well lol.
hah, no bother.
Take any excuse to vent.Fortunately for me I don’t live in USA so these things are still a bit of a rarity, and are quite impractical in my town’s, compact and heavily pedestrianised town centre.
Sounds like yoy’ve a plague of them over there.
They’re impractical in US town centers too. Drivers of these often live in suburban and rural areas and act like “omg city = CRIME and those people”, and if they come into the city, get frustrated because their giant POS vehicles are difficult to park as they’re terrible at maneuvering (drivers and the truck) and don’t fit in many parking spaces.
This is so common that when I see the rare one that can actually drive and park well in a city I actually stop being angry and switch to being impressed.
I’m sure some truck drivers are very good at it, if they have to drive large trailers often for instance. But a lot of the time their giant trucks can’t even fit into a parking spot without taking up more than one space.
Yep. You say plague, I say smooth brained consuumor zombie apocalypse.
“If you can’t Dodge it, Ram it”
I see why Stellantis spun Ram into its own brand now.
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“I am driving a lifted DODGE RAM TRUCK”
"My lifted DODGE RAM TRUCK has BLINDING WHITE LED headlights positioned EXACTLY at EYE LEVEL. "
“I am currently TAILGATING you in the RIGHT LANE even though you’re going TWENTY MILES AN HOUR over the speed limit and the LEFT LANE is OPEN.”
“There are MONSTER ENERGY and FOX RACING stickers on the rear windshield of my lifted DODGE RAM TRUCK.”
“There are PERFECTLY CLEAN mud tires and MASSIVE CHROME RIMS on my lifted DODGE RAM TRUCK.”
“I make THIRTY-ONE THOUSAND DOLLARS a year and thought that that was a WISE FINANCIAL DECISION.”
“I bring cases of BUD LIGHT to girls at high school parties while my wife and children are at home.”
“My lifted DODGE RAM TRUCK has a GUN RACK which holds the AR-15 that I bought at WAL-MART.”
Where I live Audi’s drivers are the worst. It’s like they are for losers that would like to do some posturing but can’t afford a Mercedes and their frustrations manifest themselves in their stupid driving style.
At that point is seems like a good idea to replace human drivers.
Exactly, bring in much more public transportation. It would solve so many problems.
i know many of you all just LOVE to hate on Tesla, it’s like the shit flavor of he year for hating and no doubt Elon’s shit fuckery is partially driving it, but honestly this is an absolutely classic Forbes piece of garbage. Firstly, it’s a masterclass in selective bias - focusing solely on Tesla while barely whispering about Ram’s near-similar accident rates. Classic move to sensationalize one brand over another. Then there’s the U.S. only scope, which conveniently ignores the global context which could paint a vastly different picture. The article kicks off with a ‘non-causal’ disclaimer but then spends the rest of the time subtly linking Tesla’s Autopilot to the high accident rate, without concrete evidence. It’s a bit like saying ‘no offense’ before offending someone.
The Tesla recall is mentioned, sneakily implying a connection to the accident rate, despite the lack of direct correlation. The article is less about informing and more about crafting a narrative that fits a preconceived notion, all while skating on thin ice made of half-truths and strategic omissions.
Two things are true. The article is garbage, but so are Teslas.
They’re not, though. Elon can suck it but my Tesla is the best vehicle I’ve ever owned and it’s not even close.
I heard that you don’t even have to open the door, you just slide in through a panel gap
Are you comparing with other cars at the same price range or cheaper cars?
I don’t know but based from my experience(since you also commented based on your experience), compared to some other brands although Tesla are better than some cheaper models of other brands, some are better than Tesla if you compared to the models with the same price range
Yes, some brands might be worse, but Tesla is not quite considered as being the best
Some cheaper, some the same price range.
What’s your experience based on? Do you own one? Or is this just third-hand?
I don’t care what it’s considered. It’s the best car I’ve ever owned and I’ve owned Fords, Dodges, VWs, Toyotas, and BMWs.
Ah yes a personal anecdote is 100% more valid.
That said, from what I’ve heard the big problem is the disparity of build quality. Some Tesla’s (like possibly yours) are built amazing. Some others are put together like shit.
At least I provided some kind of evidence, even if it’s an anecdote. You made a generalization with absolutely no evidence.
That’s fine if there’s a disparity but it’s not as common as your statement makes it seem.
Personal experience is not scientific or journalistic fact. As for providing evidence Google it. There’s lots of reputable sites that will tell you their build quality is inconsistent AF as well as they intentionally bully owners to accept shit.
Personal experience is still evidence. It’s not objective evidence, which normally would be a problem, but you haven’t provided any whatsoever. “Google it” doesn’t serve as a replacement for it, either.
https://lemmy.ca/comment/5795499
Also this -
Also this -
I’ll keep going if you need me to do your research for you. Not really because not my job to educate you but still.
Which is basically true for every brand, not only Tesla.
Every brand isn’t evangelized in the same way the cult of Elon pushed their golden goose. They’re run of the mill or worse than industry averages.
https://www.jdpower.com/business/press-releases/2022-us-initial-quality-study-iqs
Couple this with the ridiculous price point on the vehicles and you have apple cars so to that point I can understand the delusional obsession with the brand and supporting it
Every brand isn’t evangelized in the same way the cult of Elon pushed their golden goose.
Maybe, but ask an Alfa Romeo fans about the brand… they are way worse than the Tesla fans… 😉
They’re run of the mill or worse than industry averages.
Look, I can tell way worse things about Renault if I look at how my car came out, so ? And I would concede that Tesla is pretty new to mass producted cars. During the years I found many quality problems also with brand that are even more evangelized and have a way longer history.
Couple this with the ridiculous price point on the vehicles and you have apple cars so to that point I can understand the delusional obsession with the brand and supporting it
In Italy, a couple of models (Y and 3) are pretty much aligned with other brand’s cars of the same category, so they don’t seems to be that expensive. Or the other brands are too expensive.
I love that you were downvoted, for all we know your previous vehicle was a Daewoo or something. A Tesla is likely a better quality vehicle than a Daewoo.
Last time a garbage clickbait hit-piece like this pissed me off, I looked into the crash statistics myself and found Tesla vehicles were around 1/80th the average crash ratio per capita.
I’m sure this is somewhat skewed by the kinds of people driving them versus the average work vehicles and clunkers out there, but still, it just feels absurdly false to claim Teslas even approach the highest crash rate.
And even the sketchy “study” not even endorsed by the site it’s posted to, then linked by Forbes, then says Ram vehicles as the highest crash rate (lol), so it’s wild that Forbes goes on to say it’s Tesla at the top spot.
Per capita means nothing in this situation.
Huh, so like every single article nowadays, basically.
To be fair, Tesla / Musk spend a LOT of time talking about how they’re autonomous driving product are critical for reducing accidents and saving lives. Also, there isn’t a lot of public quantitative data around this major recall. That’s why they’re getting the headline.
Maybe autopilot is great, and it’s the non-autopilot drivers that are terrible, but right now, the brand has net accident rate that rivals a company that sells massive rolling blind spots to people who love Calvin pissing stickers.
When this was posted yesterday, I brought up issues with the sample selection (not random) and universe the “study” looked at (people using one of those sites to shop for insurance), and while I think most understood my point, some people got upset at me “defending Tesla drivers”…
They also don’t make any adjustment for fault. Tailgating a Tesla is just a bad idea, they brake insanely fast.
Tailgating anyone is a bad idea.
Yeah, but tailgating a Tesla just hits different
Thank you. This is exactly right, it’s a hit piece designed to get people who already don’t like Tesla all worked up… and it worked remarkably well.
Because a bunch of idiots take their hands off their steering wheel and think Elmo’s car is 100% safe.
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They’re going off of Lending Tree’s internal insurance quote data. That link about the lending tree quote showed this, “Our latest analysis uses QuoteWizard by LendingTree insurance quote data…”
Insurance rates are usually determined by risk associated with the car and driver and the value of the car. The lending tree analysis showed they were looking at several factors as well as accidents. They said also that Ram drivers have the “highest incident rates,” meaning they lumped together accidents, DUIs, speeding violations, and other traffic citations. This should come as no surprise to anyone who has seen a Ram.
The actual source is on the first sentence, this is just a tabloid repost
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Even the Lending Tree “article” has a disclaimer at the top that they haven’t reviewed or approved any of it.
This is purely my anecdotal experience, but Tesla drivers appear to be some of the worst drivers on the road. There are stereotypes of drivers. BMW’s never signal their turns, Jeeps think they can drive basically however they want including on shoulders, and Tesla drivers are oblivious to any kind of spatial understanding of the road around them.
Fun fact, the Lending Tree analysis listed in the article showed that Ram drivers have the “highest incident rate,” which looks at accidents, DUIs, speeding, and other traffic citations. This makes them the statistically worst drivers. BMWs have honorable mention as the having the highest DUI rate.
and Tesla drivers are oblivious to any kind of reality
Fixed based on experience. I really do feel like these are scarlet letters to being thundering assholes, and they communicate with their king like wifi routers.
Yeah all the priest drivers switched to tesla’s, I’ve seen them so many times getting in the highway going to slow and merging across all lanes just to cause traffic
I came here to say exactly that. You can blame Musk for many things, but the cars are only as good as their drivers, and they are some of the worst I’ve seen indeed.
A friendly reminder that road safety advocates recommend against the use of the word “accident” to describe car crashes, because it downplays the fact that many crashes are preventable, either by better safe road design or by the drivers being more responsible with with 2 tonne machinery they are operating.
Here is an alternative Piped link(s):
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I’m open-source; check me out at GitHub.
If it isn’t intentional then isn’t it by definition an accident?
If I break my leg while mountainbiking it seems a bit unreasonable to claim that it wasn’t an accident because mountainbiking is an extreme sport and this could’ve been avoided if I was knitting instead.
I’m speeding through a school zone at 60km/h… I didnt INTEND to kill anyone, but i didnt see the crosswalk and mowed down a bunch of pedestrians.
This is not an accident. Entirely preventable. Intent doesnt matter
The vast majority of car collisions are entirely avoidable.
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In aviation, an intentional accident is still an accident. A suicidal pilot can deliberately crash an airplane, and it’s still considered an accident.
Yeah, that’ll fix it!
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Maybe they’re sentient and actively suicidal.
This reminds me of a cheesy Dutch movie from the 80s called The Lift in which an elevator becomes self aware and starts murdering people…
Maybe they’re sentient and actively *revolutionary
It would be a brilliant way to knock people off.
Terra Ignota used carefully calculated automobile tragedies as a pretext for civil war.
A plane crash was used as the pretext for the civil war/genocide in Rwanda
And doesn’t his newest atrocity, long overdue and underdelivered/overpriced, also have a front end like a knife?
But Tesla always says the opposite.
regulators who don’t trust FSD are KILLING people because it’s so safe -Elron
THE JUDGE IS THE PEOPLE OF EARTH!
now please excuse me while I, free speech absolutist Felon Musk, go and intimidate videos showing how shitty Autopilot and FSD off of the internet.
I smell last well tonight with John Oliver
I have been following Musk’s insanity for years now, and I am glad that Oliver covered him, but he could have been soooo much more scathing while being absolutely factual.
His relatively moderate criticisms of Musk reminded me that a whole lot of libs and tech bros are in his demographic.
You can’t apparently tell them Rocket Jesus is not going to save us and is infact a contemptible racist fascist mad man whose entire persona is a fraud and has done nothing but defraud all his investors with insane claims he hasnt delivered on in nearly a decade without making his audience too depressed, I guess.
Our latest analysis uses QuoteWizard by LendingTree insurance quote data to determine which car brands have the worst drivers.
Wonder how many drivers of each brand they actually have, that would very much sway the numbers if they have smaller numbers of some brands insured.
This sounds like less of a “study” and more of a top ten list for page views.
The right source for this kind of stuff is the NHTSA’s database, but you can’t manufacture juicy headlines from that.
My guess it’s kind of like when you get solar panels and you’re tied to the grid you feel a little better about using electricity willy-nilly, and so you use more electricity with solar panels than without.
I’m willing to bet that Tesla drivers were told that this vehicle will prevent them from getting an accident and so they are driving worse because they feel like they don’t have to be as on guard as they do behind a non Tesla vehicle.
Could also be things like fast acceleration pulling the numbers up. A lot of people are going to gun it if you give them something that can do 0-60 under 4 seconds. Those are numbers that were relegated to expensive sports cars a decade ago, not a grocery getter.
Is this speed special in Tesla cars or all consumer electric or normal cars? Why waste money to give a grocery getter that much extra power
I have a hard time seeing why the average person should have a zero to 60 in the sub 6 second range. People fucking suck at driving.
Oh this is hilarious. First, I own a Mercury and a Ram, so I’m apparently the best and the worst at having accidents, DUIs, and tickets.
But I think there’s an inherent terrible bias in the data: “Our latest analysis uses QuoteWizard by LendingTree insurance quote data…” In other words, people who are regularly shopping for insurance. Probably because they have high rates, so therefore they are looking for better rates. Why do they have high rates? Probably because they have more crashes, DUIs, and other tickets than the average drivers.
I doubt that most people with normal rates go changing insurance companies regularly.
You should always rate shop on a regular basis. There is no such thing as loyalty to an insurance company. I cannot think of any corporate entity with less loyal than an insurance company.
Yes, there are a million things I should be doing, if you watch the financial advice. But no one really has the time to do all of those things. And you have to watch that you’re getting an actual quote from the company, not just a pre-quote that can be revised later. It’s a lot of time and work.
Also, with the horror stories I hear about other companies, I’m inclined to stick with mine even if they are a bit more. When our car was totaled a few years ago, they offered exactly what similar condition cars of the same make and model were selling for in our area, plus tax and fees, minus our deductible. We had done the research, and I was bracing for a fight, so I was stunned when they opened with that amount, then added the taxes and fees. We literally could have taken the check we received, plus our deductible, and replaced the car with one in similar condition and mileage (I wish we had, because I really dislike the car we bought instead). I see the horror stories people post about other companies, and I’m always thinking, “yeah, that wasn’t my experience.”
Here’s where the loyalty part comes into play: if the insurance company doesn’t like something, they can and will drop you or refuse to renew your policy depending on relevant laws. They might have decent service and pay claims without much of a fight, and those are incredibly valuable service qualities. So you’re making the right decision for yourself if that’s what’s important to you and that’s the experience you’ve had.
But if all things are equal, there’s no good reason to pay a higher premium for the same service. You better believe that insurance company will drop you in a heartbeat if their analysis indicates that they won’t have the level of profit from you that they want. As a for-profit business, that’s their perogative just as much as it’s yours if you want to switch.
I tend to agree with you by the way. Loyalty comes in many forms. I might not be loyal to a company per se. If they’ve consistently provided me with a level of service that I’m satisfied with at a price that I feel is appropriate for the value, then I’m not going to go through the trouble of checking prices and switching carriers every year just to save a few bucks. And there’s the hassle of being hounded by a half dozen companies that now have your contact info after you requested quotes. That’s all a big no thanks from me.
Is it possible that there’s a large overlap between idiots who are bad at driving and the type of people who buy Teslas?
I’m not looking forward to the day a tesla cyber truck hits someone. That’s gonna be a grisly scene in the right conditions.
I wonder if it’ll pass safety regs outside of the US
AFAIK they won’t even try to homologate it.
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yeah pedestrian safety is what I meant, thanks
